Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.960514141535.18575B-100000@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 14:24:45 -0500 From: Mbalo Ndiaye <mailto:ndia0002@MAROON.TC.UMN.EDU> Subject: Re: Computers to Africa To: Multiple recipients of list DEVEL-L <mailto:DEVEL-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
YOU REACHED THE KEYS POINTS. IT'S ABOUT SPARE PARTS AVAILABILITY AND MOST IMPORTANT THE ABILITY OF THE RECIPIENTS TO COVER OPERATING COSTS ASSOCIATED WITH THE DAILY MAINTENANCE OF OLD EQUIPMENT. Those of you who got the chance to work in African governmental or non-governmental agencies probably understand what operating budget stands for.BY the way, I appreciate all the contributions. I couldn't imagine how resourceful this debate would be when I initiated it. I apologize if I hurt the feeling of some of you.
On Sun, 12 May 1996, Marcus Day wrote:
> To me this is a difficult question. To some extent I agree with both
> participants. I live in the developing world and I have seen first hand both
> sides of this issue. I have seen in the past two years a weird old Wang network
> with 8" floppies sent do here, with propriatary operating system that litterally
> went straight to the land fill. On the other hand my wife and I own a
> montessori preschool and use 3 XT 8088 computers with 20 meg hard drives and CGA
> monitors to run 1989 versions of share ware eductional software. The kids love
> it and more important I have the technical expertice and alot of junk for spare
> parts to keep them running.
>
> If the human resourses and spare parts are present to keep the "old" equipment
> running it will work. Sending any technologhy (new or old) to a place with out
> manuals, spares parts and support is a waste of money. Most governments do not
> have the money to maintain donor gifts so when they break down, its either off
> to the landfill or more likely the object rots in it place with people saying
> "oh thats a good _________________, (fill in the blank) it just needs something,
> we wrote to the name on the plate but they haven't written back"
>
> I recently saw a 60 cycle generator burn out a 50 cycle UPS (both 220v) both
> generously donated by the Gov of Canada, the generators souced in Canada and
> shipped down, the UPS purchased locally. The "Consultant" should have known
> better. They replaced the UPS with a 60 cycle US model. Then the 60 cycle
> generator burnt out and they used a stand by 50 cycle generator that then blew
> the 6o cycle UPS. see a pattern yet.
>
> And so the North / South debate continues.
>
> Marcus Day
> St. Lucia
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, 10 May 1996, Wilbur Streett <mailto:wstreett@MONMOUTH.COM> wrote:
> >Direct message to Chris.. I'm sorry about the tone of this message, but
> >this guy needs to be straightened out..
> >
> >At 08:34 AM 5/9/96 EST, you wrote:
> >>This same subject was brought up months ago, when some wanna-be
> >>development expert believed that we should send old TRS-80 machines
> >>to Africa. I said it before, and I will say it again........"When
> >>will we stop treating Africa like some backward colonial state full
> >>of unintelligent people?"
> >
> >Perhaps when you look in the mirror and realize that you are treating them
> >like they are some backward colonial state full of unintelligent people,
> >unable to make decisions for themselves, there will be one less person
> >fostering this attitude. People have a right to make their own decisions,
> >and they are smart enough to figure out if they would like old equipment or
> >not. Not that old equipment means that the technology is out of date.
> >Last year I used "second hand" technology in the form of an old PC. I
> >loaded Unix on one of the hard disks, and Windows and Netscape on the other.
> >I used that old technology to write a proposal for a MIB Compiler to
> >Netmanage, Inc. The proposal was accepted, and using a somewhat blurry
> >monitor, and the old by anyone's standard AMD 386SX/20 computer with 4 MB of
> >ram, also using Lex and YACC and an old C compiler, (technology over 20
> >years old), I wrote the MIB Compiler (which is state of the art) and was
> >paid quite a bit of money for it. With the money that I earned, I bought a
> >new Pentium and a new monitor.. I replaced the motherboard in the old
> >computer with a 486/33 motherboard, (for $125) and gave it to my brother in
> >law. He bought the new RAM, ($200) which he is now using to learn about
> >the Internet and creating music with the computer so that he will make a
> >wise decision when he goes to spend his money to buy a new system.. So I
> >guess that I wasted my time working with less than "State Of The Art"
> >equipment, and the "State Of The Art" technology that I created doesn't
> >count since I used old equipment?
> >
> >The computer industry works to preserve the image that old computer
> >technology isn't worth very much, now else will they ever get us to buy the
> >new generation of technology when the current one works just fine. Haven't
> >you ever heard of "Planned Obsolesence?" Today I printed out a manual for
> >new technology from Intel on a printer that is 8 years old, is the
> >information on state of the art software on the printed pages any less valid
> >because the printer is old?
> >
> >>When will we be smart enough to break the cycle of dependancy we create by
> >sending trash overseas?
> >
> >It seems to me that the only dependencies that are in place are caused by
> >people like you with arrogant, prideful attitudes that don't understand that
> >technology isn't something that comes in the bright, shiny new packages but
> >is learned by doing. Your great college education has created a consumer
> >mentality in you which condemns those that don't have the benefit of of that
> >education to a "lower" social status. Too bad it didn't teach you about the
> >real world. It does seem to have taught you something, perhaps you should
> >examine what that is.
> >
> >It seems to me that people with your sort of arrogance are what is holding
> >those in Africa down. If they want to use the (what you call trash)
> >technology, to useful ends, who are you to try to stop them? In case you
> >haven't figured it out yet, poverty is usually created by pride. I don't
> >know of any case where it has been caused by used computer equipment.
> >
> >Haven't you ever heard the saying "Don't look a gift horse in the mouth?"
> >How much technology will you prevent from helping those in Africa that could
> >use it with your checking the gift horse's teeth? How many people have to
> >do without technology because of your arrogance?
> >
> >As to breaking the cycle of dependancy, how do you think that new equipment
> >will make any difference? If only new equipment will do, and only new
> >equipment is easy enough to use, then you'll get to pay the bill for the new
> >equipment. That financial burden will create real dependencies that are
> >much greater than a bit of surplus equipment. Not that the new equipment
> >will provide better Internet access, word processing, or spreadsheet
> >usability than 4 or 5 year old equipment does.
> >
> >Wilbur
> >---------------------------------------
> >Putting a human face on technology. ;-)
> >---------------------------------------
> >
> >
> >
>